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Parameters Hornresp

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1 Parameters Hornresp le Mar 30 Oct 2012 - 18:27

Fireboy


Hi, is possible to have the parameters to be included in hornresp of MTH-46VS and MTH-4658, in order to simulate with other woofer. Thanks very much

Ps. Sorry for my bad english Embarassed

2 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Lun 10 Déc 2012 - 4:02

Masssive


hey,

i have 2 mth4654's loaded with b&c 18nw100. they are awesome, huge sound.

Marc also simmed 18sound lw2400 for me and said they should work well too.

what drivers are you wanting to put in them

3 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Sam 19 Jan 2013 - 0:49

Dj Maestro

avatar
Masssive a écrit:hey,

i have 2 mth4654's loaded with b&c 18nw100. they are awesome, huge sound.

Marc also simmed 18sound lw2400 for me and said they should work well too.

what drivers are you wanting to put in them

hi,
what can you tell me about the throw of this cab....are you using them in or outdoor?

4 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Sam 19 Jan 2013 - 1:47

Marc34

avatar
"throw" is a misunderstood concept. The only way to make better throw is to generate a line source array which is very difficult in bass range, you will need a long line, see this article:

[Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien]

But our ears are very sensible to some things, and ears are more sensitive at 100Hz than 50Hz, so if you cut too low, or if you boost low frequencies (at the expense of upper bass), your ear can identify that as a short throw, but it isn't, as proved by the void paper. There's the reason why band pass enclosure are generaly qualified to short throw: first reason, they have limited frequency response, and lower max level, this why ears identify it as short throw

Another point: For max SPL, impact, and "throw" feeling, you must have your tops and bass cabinet in perfect phase (delay). You must make measurements with software like Smaart. The difference between a bad and good setting can be night and day.


_________________
"Il y a deux types de sonorisateur: ceux qui savent utiliser le bouton "preset" du processeur, et ceux qui savent à quoi servent les autres boutons."
Calculatrices Audio Android
Bons plans Thomann

5 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Lun 21 Jan 2013 - 4:04

Dj Maestro

avatar
With other words if i want 'throw and feel the bass" i must look a bassenclosure that hits hard in the 100hz area.
What are the freq range, we human can feel and heared like far throw?

Will something like the mhb- 46 then do a better job..something that can deliver sub bass and kick?or a folded horn..

6 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Lun 21 Jan 2013 - 7:31

Masssive


Hey Dj Maestro,

In my experience if you want long throw for outdoor use you cant beat a nice line of folded horns, at least 4 i would say.

I currently have only 2 MTH4654 so cant say how they work in a line. But the two i have sound very very full and will cover a couple of hundred people outdoor. They sound great indoor as well, they seem to just fill the room up with bass with ease. Folded horns and front loaded boxes seem to sound consticed and hollow next to them. They also get below 40hz with 1 box.

7 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Lun 21 Jan 2013 - 16:32

Marc34

avatar
With other words if i want 'throw and feel the bass" i must look a bassenclosure that hits hard in the 100hz area.
What are the freq range, we human can feel and heared like far throw?

Will something like the mhb- 46 then do a better job..something that can deliver sub bass and kick?or a folded horn..
All scoops have a dip in frequency response near the kick frequency range. So they can make bass, but for kick, you need to add a "Kick Bin". Without Kick bin, you can have this sensation of "bad throw" because the dip in frequency response of the kick. Most scoop must be cut between 70/90Hz, then the kick bin takes over.

If you want a all in one cabinet, bass + kick, the hybrid like MHB-46 and MHB-4818 are. They are very physical, "in your chest" and have the "long throw feeling". MHB-4818 has been measured at 106.8dB at 1w/1m in the 50/120Hz range (110dB 1w/1m at 200Hz!)

All others cabinets with long horn (2 meters and more) need a kick bin. MTH-4654 needs a kick bin.


In my experience if you want long throw for outdoor use you cant beat a nice line of folded horns, at least 4 i would say.
Throw is more related to psycho-acoustics than a real level difference between designs (as shown in the Void paper). All cabinets in a PA system must be considered as a single entity: if one cabinet is not in perfect phase with others cabinets, if the frequency response has dips, it can radically change sound perception.



_________________
"Il y a deux types de sonorisateur: ceux qui savent utiliser le bouton "preset" du processeur, et ceux qui savent à quoi servent les autres boutons."
Calculatrices Audio Android
Bons plans Thomann

8 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Lun 21 Jan 2013 - 23:31

Dj Maestro

avatar
many thanx marc and massive for your advise...In my country most dj's use scoops, but mostly with not the recommended drivers, they just buy drivers(mostly china made drivers) and put them in scoops, they dont know better...
I always have use reflex bins (g sub with p audio drivers 600w)but now i own 4 18LW2400.. I just wanna the best output from those speakers...I am looking the mhb 46 for a while but im not sure if i can go with it..I have already 4 ms46 indoor they hits hard, but outdoor i can not feel the bass after 3-5m.

9 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Lun 21 Jan 2013 - 23:48

Marc34

avatar
You can use the 18LW2400 in the MHB-46, it will be perfect. Just make the vent little longer to 21cm.


_________________
"Il y a deux types de sonorisateur: ceux qui savent utiliser le bouton "preset" du processeur, et ceux qui savent à quoi servent les autres boutons."
Calculatrices Audio Android
Bons plans Thomann

10 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Mar 22 Jan 2013 - 0:17

Dj Maestro

avatar
Masssive a écrit:Hey Dj Maestro,

In my experience if you want long throw for outdoor use you cant beat a nice line of folded horns, at least 4 i would say.

I currently have only 2 MTH4654 so cant say how they work in a line. But the two i have sound very very full and will cover a couple of hundred people outdoor. They sound great indoor as well, they seem to just fill the room up with bass with ease. Folded horns and front loaded boxes seem to sound consticed and hollow next to them. They also get below 40hz with 1 box.


Allright, will folded horn give me also bass and kick or only bass for outdoor use

11 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Mar 22 Jan 2013 - 17:45

Dj Maestro

avatar
Marc34 a écrit:You can use the 18LW2400 in the MHB-46, it will be perfect. Just make the vent little longer to 21cm.

allright the vent would be now 21cm * 8,6cm then?

what difference this will have with the shorter 13,2cm..just wanna know

i already cut the sides, back and top for one pair mbh46

12 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Mar 22 Jan 2013 - 18:28

Marc34

avatar
It depends of the speakers used inside. Reflex vents sometimes need adjustements, for example : GSub [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien]

So the new vent will be 46.6cm x 8.6cm and 21cm depth.


_________________
"Il y a deux types de sonorisateur: ceux qui savent utiliser le bouton "preset" du processeur, et ceux qui savent à quoi servent les autres boutons."
Calculatrices Audio Android
Bons plans Thomann

13 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Mer 23 Jan 2013 - 7:53

Dj Maestro

avatar
Marc34 a écrit:It depends of the speakers used inside. Reflex vents sometimes need adjustements, for example : GSub [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien]

So the new vent will be 46.6cm x 8.6cm and 21cm depth.


but the f3 is still 49 per cab with a 105dB sensitivity or not?

what are the crossover points now then, I mean with deeper vents

14 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Jeu 24 Jan 2013 - 2:57

Masssive


put 4 of them (MHB 46) in a pile. the f3 drops to 42hz, much better.

I think its going to be very hard to find one sub that will give you high sensitivity, good kick and get you down near 40 Hz all at the same time.

I came very close to building MHB-46's but didnt have enough money to build enough of them, to get as low as i wanted to go. If you have 4, or more, drivers i think the MHB 46 would be sweet.

15 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Ven 25 Jan 2013 - 7:15

Dj Maestro

avatar
thanks for your inputs massive, i'm building my first one already, almost done..I hope i can test saturday...I want to use them indoor and outdoor...how many do u have? how they sound.

Someone told me to go with the invaders, they are deep sounding and loud with four outdoors they perform pretty well.. doyou heard them ever?

16 Re: Parameters Hornresp le Mar 29 Jan 2013 - 2:20

Masssive


look forward to hearing how your first box sounds. I have only mth no mhb but they do look very good on paper.

I have never heard invaders but they also look very good. I would like to hear some. DIY soundsystems are not very popular in Sydney.
As far as I know i am the only person in Sydney with DIY bass horns. I would love to stand corrected on this. Anyone?

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