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MHB 46 cabs

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26 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Ven 18 Oct 2013 - 19:47

Marc34

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The port length is not the problem, it reproduce only low frequencies. It's just a problem of correct response curve. It can be often difficult to have good balance between deep/round bass and strong kick: if you make a strong kick, it can be at the expense of the bass and vice versa. There are some effects of mask.

This type of horn can sound good up to 500Hz, but you must eq it correctly. So use measurement mic, analyser, reduce all peaks in the response curve, try to locate the frequency you hear as honk and reduce it.


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27 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Mer 6 Nov 2013 - 0:47

Freackk

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Hi, i have one question about the mhb 46 cabs. Various friends and speaker forums said that there could be some kind of phasing problem with the reflex port because it's planned for one stand-alone speaker and not for multiple stacking. In fact many told me the HP could get damaged Shocked and that it would be better to build the cabs without reflex port... now i am very sceptic about these theories so i wanted to ask your opinions...

28 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Mer 6 Nov 2013 - 11:59

Chris Kazvon

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Phasing problems ? how ?

If the distance between the center of the emitting sources is below 1/2 wavelength of the subwoofer high cut, there is no coupling problem

(this means, for a high cut at 100Hz, that if the distance from one emitting surface to another is less than 1/2 * 340/100 = 3.4m, there is no problem).


Therefore, no phasing problem for the MHB. If there were some problems, i think we would have seen them in the response curve (problems between the port and the horn).

Moreover, "deleting" the port will only bring problems: the response curve will change dramatically, as well as the power handling


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29 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Mer 6 Nov 2013 - 12:11

Ggo18

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I think he talk about this :
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30 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Mer 6 Nov 2013 - 12:23

Chris Kazvon

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I think Marc will have the best explanation Wink

but isn't 1.5m too close to the cab ? I thought the distance cab//mic should be at least 3 * the largest dimension of the cab, which, for the MHB46, is 3 * 93 = 2.80m for one cab, a bit far from the 1.5m used in this test.


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31 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Mer 6 Nov 2013 - 17:48

Marc34

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Hybrid exist for a long time, remember 4818 JBL, look at WLX Martin, WMX, ASX, etc, they are all hybrids, same principe. If you don't make the reflex port you will loose a lot of bass, and power must be reduced. The idea to not make the port is ridiculous and stupid.

Even if the gap is here (and it can be a bad measurement), you will not hear it because it is on a small bandwidth, and when you put 4 or more cabs, all gaps will gone: this is true for all cabinets. But if you don't make port, it will be clearly audible that you loose something.




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32 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Mer 6 Nov 2013 - 21:00

Freackk

avatar
Thanks for the answers, guys! Since i think Mr. Marc knows more about theses cabs than any uknown "speakerexpert" on different forums, i will go along with what he says and build those ports.
I also thought that not making the ports would dramatically infect the sound, but when i read about damging HP i was very worried affraid 

33 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Mer 6 Nov 2013 - 23:20

Skope

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Chris Kazvon a écrit:Phasing problems ? how ?

If the distance between the center of the emitting sources is below 1/2 wavelength of the subwoofer high cut, there is no coupling problem

(this means, for a high cut at 100Hz, that if the distance from one emitting surface to another is less than 1/2 * 340/100 = 3.4m, there is no problem).
Be careful because if you cut your MHB at 120 Hz , the distance fall to 2,8m Wink


I wondered btw (even if there is no coupling problems), if the setting was different between a stack and a distance of 2.5 m for example?

34 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Mer 6 Nov 2013 - 23:34

Chris Kazvon

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Electrovoice made a small guide about the subwoofer configurations, very instructive SmileSmile

downloadable here

35 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Mer 6 Nov 2013 - 23:58

Skope

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Chris Kazvon a écrit:Electrovoice made a small guide about the subwoofer configurations, very instructive  SmileSmile

downloadable here
Shocked 

Very good Wink Wink 

36 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Jeu 7 Nov 2013 - 0:48

Freackk

avatar
Chris Kazvon a écrit:Electrovoice made a small guide about the subwoofer configurations, very instructive  SmileSmile

downloadable here
nice one Smile 

another question: if i plan on using the "void v18-1000" instead of the rcf, do i have to change the size of the reflex-port?

37 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Jeu 7 Nov 2013 - 11:14

Marc34

avatar
No it can be used like that.


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38 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Ven 8 Nov 2013 - 23:25

Freackk

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Ok, good to know. Thanks!

39 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Sam 30 Nov 2013 - 3:24

Dj Maestro

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Mr. Marc I have loaded the MHB 46 with 24LW2400 2 cabs. when pushing them a little loud I can hear like over excursion. The reflex port is 23cm long. crossed at 40 hz. Whats wrong?

40 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Sam 30 Nov 2013 - 19:41

Marc34

avatar
24LW2400 ???


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41 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Mar 3 Déc 2013 - 4:22

Dj Maestro

avatar
oh sorry I mean 18LW2400. tested again today and have the same thing, when pushing a little loud, it has nice bass but with sometimes with a "duff duff" like sound. and when pushing loud then you can hear that rare sound constantly its like distorted bass or the speaker can't handle.. it is not like a rattling sound, everything is well fixed( glued and screws) Crossed at 40 hz and pushing with a amp at 1900w at 4ohm.

42 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Mar 3 Déc 2013 - 17:33

Marc34

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What is the amp? Do you use a limiter? what setting and gain of the amp?

Is there a noise problem or a distorsion? Is it an air leakage? Is cab MDF or plywood?

You can make a test with a slow sweep 30/200Hz (possible in Room Eq Wizard) and then identify if the problem append at a certain frequency, if the problem is the cab build or the speaker. Let filters on, start at low volume then then increase power.


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43 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Mar 3 Déc 2013 - 17:47

Dj Maestro

avatar
the amp is a M10 CBU. I was playing those 18LW2400 in a 4 cubos never heard something like that. the amp was pushing them very well. it's not noise it's a sound like the speakers is on its max. when playing normal volume it is playing without that sound but when I pushed them loud the sound starts between the basslines. I was playing with a eq and a dbx crosover, no limiters etc. and the filter is on 40hz. I checked the MHb 46 for air leakkage and loose parts. everything is well fixed. I'm using plywood 18mm.

44 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Mar 3 Déc 2013 - 19:07

Marc34

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Don't know the M10 CBU amp, can't find anything on it. Difficult to say what is wrong without testing it. What I can say, MHB-46 is one of the most builded cabinet in France (hundreds builded), nobody reported your problem. Test it with a sine sweep and try to determinate problem, cab, speaker, amp or other.

I've simulate the 18LW1400, it can be used with an 1000 watt amplifier, and there 's no reason for problem if you use it properly, so no amp power higher than 1000 watts, no amp clip, butterworth 24dB/oct high pass.


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45 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Jeu 5 Déc 2013 - 16:57

Dj Maestro

avatar
that should be 1000@ 8ohms for one driver, but for double driver 2000@ 4ohm should be also fine or am I wrong? The amp is pushing 1700W @ 4ohm.
In the weekend I will test again with freq slow sweeps.

46 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Sam 24 Mai 2014 - 6:23

Dj Maestro

avatar
build 2 of these cabs and loaded with 18lw2400, when playing at a nomal level they are playing very well, but when i push them loud, I get some fart sound from the box... Dont now why it is doing so, when trying to use like a kick cab, they kick very hard with only 2, but when i put dome low end and push it loud, they sound good

47 Re: MHB 46 cabs le Sam 24 Mai 2014 - 19:44

Marc34

avatar
Have you used an high pass filter? what frequency and slope?

Do you use a limiter? What LMS and settings on the limiter? What amp on what gain?


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